EMERGENCY: Need SPS Guru

[SeaMonkey]

So I did it... I bought some beautiful SPS, I acclimated/treated them, and now they are dead - I believe.

What did I do wrong??? I tested my water parameters - they were seemingly perfect before I added the SPS to my tank. They were fine when I bought them. I put them in a bucket, floated them for 6 hours, doing half cup additions of tank water every 30 minutes. I put in an interceptor tablet at the beginning of the process. Everything went fine, until the end when I added the Betadine/Iodine and let it sit for 10-15 minutes. I added enough to get the water a light tea color. I then emptied the water, and noticed a lot of stringy dirty mucusy stuff coming off of the coral. I added my tank water to the bucket and rinsed it, let it sit for about an hour before I took it out of that water, and placed it on my frag rack. I noticed little patches of white on the corals at that time. This morning, there were more patches of white, and stringy mucus. I used my turkey baster and blew the gunk off of the coral - and EVERYTHING came off of them, leaving a bone white coral skeleton. I am guessing that means they are dead for good, no coming back.

What could have happened? I have not even had them for 24 hours...

 

[SeaMonkey]

Also wanted to add that most of the ones that kicked the bucket are fresh cut (Did I add to the stress with the bath? Did I acclimate too fast? Should I have left the light on for them longer after I put them in my tank?) They were so beautiful and healthy, and I got them from a reputable local source, I have not heard of anyone else having problems with their corals they bought from this person. So I figure I must have done something wrong. I would like to save them if I can....

 

[Dragon2115]

Sorry for your loss.

There's no telling if they'll recover or not. I have a couple of corals that recovered from what I would swear was only having one molecule left alive. My bali green slimer took a couple of months before I even saw anything alive where it used to be. Just put them aside and see what happens. That's about all you can do.

As for what went wrong. About the only thing I can think of from what you described is possibly the betadine was too strong or because it was mixed in with interceptor. Or did you use separate containers? Betadine should be at a concentration of no more than 3ml per liter of water. When I mix it it doesn't discolor the water much. I would describe it as dirty looking water rather than light colored tea.

 

[SeaMonkey]

Thanks for the glimmer of hope, I blew off as much of the dead tissue as I could, and placed it where it would get good flow. It has good lighting, so I hope it recovers (crossing my fingers).

This was my first time dipping coral, so.... I did put the betadine in with the same water that had the interceptor, and the tea color I went for was like half a shade of sun tea if that makes any sense. I should have done more research on the exact dosage.

An expensive mistake to make

 

[mgreefer]

You mentioned few things that I just want to make sure I read you right.

First you said you acclimated for 6 hrs during which you have been adding tank water, personally I think this is way too much, to me one hour or two is very plenty to acclimate, but this is just me. If you were acclimating and treating at the same time, and that’s why it was 6 hrs, I personally acclimate first, then treat.

Second you said you put an interceptor tablet, if this is the case then I think this maybe have been too much, a one or two scoops of the little measuring spoon of test kits (salifert or Elos) is enough as per my experience for a 3-5gal. Slight over dosing is okay, but one whole tablet that’s a lot I think.

Third you said you added Betadine/iodine until the water was light tea color. I am not sure what does that mean with respect to the ratio of iodine to water. My rule of thumb is 4ml/liter of water. I also add a little power head for circulation as well as an air stone I have found that pumping air help reduce the stress. So I don’t know based on what you said if there was too much iodine or not. Iodine is very stressful to corals.

So if they are dead as you think they are, it could have been from anything (too much interceptor, too much iodine) or as simple as a large swing in temp between the water in the treatment bucket and the tank water when you moved them into the tank.

Regarding saving them, I don’t have an answer and I don’t know if there is anything that you can do. Maybe just keep them in the tank for a few weeks or more and if there are any none-dead parts of the coral hopefully it will recover and come back.

On another note, treatment does not kill the eggs, so quarantining the coral for a few weeks and observing it for any signs of new hatched pests before going into the display is always a good idea.

 

[SeaMonkey]

The interceptor tablet was the kind for small dogs, 2-10 pounds (2.3mg). I estimate I ended up at about 1 gallon of water total over the 6 hours.

As for the iodine, I did not measure it... (I think this was where things started going downhill)

The treatment bucket was floating in the tank, so the temperatures were identical when I moved it to the main tank.

Also, I had a small power head, but no air stone (possibly another problem).

I appreciate all of the advice, I would like to keep from making the same mistakes twice.

 

[stingythingy45]

"Also, I had a small power head, but no air stone (possibly another problem)."

I'm no SPS guru,but this was the first thing that crossed my mind.
Did the PH have a venturi to add some aeration to the bucket?

 

[SeaMonkey]

Would I have needed aeration for the 6 hours? I thought that as long as there was flow (so they could breath) it would be okay. My thoughts behind this were in shipping, they are usually okay overnight, so I thought they would be okay during acclimation.

In the future I will add a bubble stone, I have them I just didn't think about it.

 

[willray]

Would I have needed aeration for the 6 hours? I thought that as long as there was flow (so they could breath) it would be okay. My thoughts behind this were in shipping, they are usually okay overnight, so I thought they would be okay during acclimation.

In the future I will add a bubble stone, I have them I just didn't think about it.

I am no guru but imo....No aeration needed,more of hindrance imo.
6 hrs is a long time.
How was the container they were acclimating in kept up to temp?

 

[snowmaker]

Sorry for this loss... I am wondering - I didn't read that you had a heater in the bucket? in 6 hrs that water would be very cool. FWIW, I'll acclimate for 1/2 hr at most for corals and do not recall losing any in past couple years. A friend doesn't acclimate at all and his seem to do fine as well. "Floating" I will do for temperature acclimation for 10 minutes or so, then water exchanges for 20 min to 1/2 hr.
Sounds like your solutions may have been too strong, or soaked too long or both.
I will do a 15 min. dip in Tropic Marin Pro Coral Cure (TMPCC) at their suggested dosage of 1 squirt / litre and blow anything off the coral with turkey baster. If I see anything that looks like eggs, then the Oral-B electric tooth brush comes out (to scrub the rock, not the coral itself). I'll set up a fresh SW container for final rinse / shake before going into QT or display.

 

[afboundguy]

As for what went wrong. About the only thing I can think of from what you described is possibly the betadine was too strong or because it was mixed in with interceptor. .

I've always thrown in betadine/iodine at the end of the interceptor dip. I think there was too much added for too long. I always do 5 mins. Anything over 10 mins would prob just hurt the coral...

First you said you acclimated for 6 hrs during which you have been adding tank water, personally I think this is way too much, to me one hour or two is very plenty to acclimate, but this is just me. If you were acclimating and treating at the same time, and that’s why it was 6 hrs, I personally acclimate first, then treat.

I agree here. 6 hours is way too much. Acclimate first for an hour maybe two then treat for 6 hours...

Second you said you put an interceptor tablet, if this is the case then I think this maybe have been too much, a one or two scoops of the little measuring spoon of test kits (salifert or Elos) is enough as per my experience for a 3-5gal. Slight over dosing is okay, but one whole tablet that’s a lot I think.

IIRC corals can withstand a very high dose of interceptor when they are being dipped by themselves. I never measure when I'm dipping I just put in a bunch

 

[delta]

The betadine will bleach them out they will be totally white and look dead leave them in the tanks and see what happens. FWIW I treat for 6 hrs with interceptor and then 25 minutes with betadine many time well over recommended dosage. The Coral do loose their color but color up fine . Sometimes they totally bleach out and look dead. Wait a few days and you should see some polyp extension. Although during the treatment I aerate
the treatment tank.
IME when I didn't use an air stone and and used a small power head I had more losses.

I would only take 20minutes or so to acclimate to your water parameters in the future. I pretty much use this time to flush out the water from the previous holding tank and make it 100% of my tank water, before treating the corals. After the treaetment they go through 4 to 5 baths of clean tank water before going tinto quarantine.

Keep the new corals in good flow but out of really strong light, and definitely out of the sand.

 

[wrassefan]

the fact that you are not sure what the water volume is in the bucket compared to the dose of the interceptor and betadine is your fist mistake. I don't recall off hand what the dose is suppose to be but I know it didn't take much to be effective. I know that betadine is 3ml to each liter of water. Aeration and temp should be normal tank temp....if you don't aerate the bucket for six hours, it's like having your tank shutdown for six hours without aeration....can survive, but you don't know..fwiw, you never know about fresh cut corals....some make it ...some don't....

 

[Reefried]

the betadine killed your frags thats a fact, and it wasnt the 20 mins of tea colored water it was the hour after that in which you diluted the tea colored water.....betadine is VERY strong and I recomend it for the last 20 mins of an interceptor bath but only with you keeping a close eye on the frags as some will tolerate more than others and some will slime imediately, and need to be removed quickly..........

.....next time set up a 2.5gall tank with a mini-jet 404 or 606 forget the airstone, and remenber the large interceptor pill treats 400 galls so in the 2.5gall tank use 1/8 of a pill which should treat 50 galls and be strong enough for the dip and not too strong......dip it for 5 hours and 40 mins....the add betadine to the tank and I add about 15mls to the 2.5gall tank and it turns the water a tea color like you mentioned....during the betadine dip WATCH the corals closely ( I use a flashlight) and if they slime a lot then remove the frag....remember that the betadine is to kill any pests other than red-bugs and they usually die off within the first minute of the betadine dip.....I have seen flatworms literally melt in betadine in seconds........when the 20mins is up or when you removed all frags cause they were stressed, then shake them off in a cup of tank water and check for remaining pests then put them into the display tank.....I think you mixed frag dipping with fish acclimation and thats why your frags died......I've had many losses from betadine, be carefull........I've also had frags that looked dead from the dip and came back months later......good luck.........even though you diluted the water by 50% after the betadine there was enough in the water to finish off the already weak frags, especially with them in there for an hour....

.....I have also experienced with strong doses of interceptor and that was likely not the cause of the frags demise.....the fact that they can tolerate a 6 hour dip speaks to their ability to tolerate interceptor.....

 

[SeaMonkey]

the betadine killed your frags thats a fact, and it wasnt the 20 mins of tea colored water it was the hour after that in which you diluted the tea colored water.....betadine is VERY strong and I recomend it for the last 20 mins of an interceptor bath but only with you keeping a close eye on the frags as some will tolerate more than others and some will slime imediately, and need to be removed quickly..........
.

After the 10 or so minutes - They were removed from the "tea colored water" and put into a fresh bucket of tank water to rinse off before going into the main tank. I did not dilute the betadine water at all. Sorry for any confusion there.

As for how I kept up the temperature, I floated a 1.5 gallon bucket in the main tank itself, so that it would be the same temp when I put them in the main tank.

I have the coral under close observation, but there is still not a sign of life yet. I don't know if I would describe the phenomenon as "bleaching" - it was more like "peeling/sloughing". I am crossing my fingers that they come back - lessons learned

I don't want anyone to think that I just decided to go pour in some betadine without researching it. I was advised to use this method, and I guess I just assumed it was safe. In the future I will research advice just in case it was also assumed that I know better than to do something completely blonde....

 

[delta]

I have the coral under close observation, but there is still not a sign of life yet. I don't know if I would describe the phenomenon as "bleaching" - it was more like "peeling/sloughing". I am crossing my fingers that they come back - lessons learned

That is not a good sign, if they bleached there would not have been any tissue loss.

The betadine is a good treatment and not too harsh it is the interceptor that is pretty harsh.

However there are many things that can go wrong some you just can not predict some corals response.
Some corals, especially fresh cut, can just die off even if you do everything right.

I would just try some run of the mill corals green slimer or yellow Milli (cheap ones )until you get the
acclimation/treatment down. I would pay more attention to the interceptor treatment and make sure
the slime is removed from the coral during treatment. If you use a power head and don;t have success
go to an air stone. The air stone will make the betadine foam so be for warned.

Also it is not worth the temp adjustment to risk doing this treatment in a bucket in tank, should you have an accident.

 

[SeaMonkey]

Also it is not worth the temp adjustment to risk doing this treatment in a bucket in tank, should you have an accident.

Good point :: I like the idea of having a dip tank, I will go that route next time.

 

[coralcor]

that stinks.... for some reason my sps is closed up. the plate corali have had for ever....