I'm still kindf a noob and got kind of a dumb question so please bear with me...lol

[jmnewman2]

My question is can pre-mixed saltwater "go bad". I guess what I'm trying to get at is I do roughly a 30 gallon water change weekly and I was thinking about pre-mixing a jug of about 200 gallons worth of salt water to the specific salinity and temperature that my tank is so that when I do my water changes I can just siphon the water down the drain and then flip a switch and have the salt water be pumped right back into the tank rather than having to mix water every change or have to wait a day to do my change because I forgot to mix my water. I use RO/DI water and Red Sea coral pro salt(black bucket)

Thanks guys!!

Jason

 

[mnavick]

Can't comment on an extended time, like 6 months to a year.
However as long as you keep it aerated and heated it should be fine for a month or two. Just watch for evaporation and test salinity before water change.

 

[s_kelley]

I mix about 40 gallons and keep it heated and has a power head in it to keep it moving, I try and do a water change every other week. Like it says above, just check for evaporation because that will increase salinity.

 

[jmnewman2]

I try to keep it heated to my tank temperature which is 78.9° to 79.8° And I can throw in old air pump with an air stone in there as well if that will help it "stay fresh"as far as evaporation goes I have a pretty tight lid on it and I know at least when I have had my RO water in there for about a month or so there was very very little to almost no evaporation whatsoever. I always test the salinity of my water change water even if I just makes it that day or the day before out of habit because of a past issue I had when I read the mixing ratios of salt to water Rowgh and made a solution that was way too strong and almost wiped out my entire tank..lol so in theory as long as I keep the water heated to tank temperature, aerated with a air pump and circulated with a powerhead if there is no of aberration the water should keep indefinitely?

 

[jmnewman2]

I just did the math and if I forgot to mention if I mixed 200 gallons of salt water it would have to keep for roughly 7 weeks(6.666666666666667 weeks to be exact...hahaha) since I change 30 gallons every week in water changes.

 

[ro_nicu]

your main concern would be if something got into the container and started and ammonia cycle or contaminated the water, other than that, keep it aerated and if should be fine regardless of the temperature but you will have to bring it to the right temp when doing the water change.

 

[higorc]

I ALWAYS have at least 5G of mixed saltwater in a HD bucket and never had a problem with it. I keep it there sometimes for weeks, sometimes over a month. I use it for acclimating new corals and/or when I sell a frag.

No power head, no heat, but I do keep it tightly closed. If it does go bad after its been siting for that long, I never notice or had any issues with it when I put it my tank. I might test the water next time, just cause you made me wonder now...

Not sure if that answers your question, but there you go . I would say it doesn't go bad as long as you keep it sealed and as Nick said, don't let it get contaminated .



Higor

 

[panayiote73]

If you keep water in a tank or bucket or barrel for 7 weeks you will start a cycle. Bacteria and Algae coat every inch of this planet. The amount of colony forming units (CFU's) in your container, water, or workspace will be your variable. In other words your unique situation will dictate the outcome but your asking for trouble.

I mix and use my water within 2-4 days. I do a weekly water change of 5g in a 120g. IMO, this eliminates the need to heat the water. More frequent smaller water changes are best. How big is your system to do a 30g water change weekly? That doesn't sound like a "noob" system at all.

 

[nemodan]

If you keep water in a tank or bucket or barrel for 7 weeks you will start a cycle. Bacteria and Algae coat every inch of this planet. The amount of colony forming units (CFU's) in your container, water, or workspace will be your variable. In other words your unique situation will dictate the outcome but your asking for trouble.

I mix and use my water within 2-4 days. I do a weekly water change of 5g in a 120g. IMO, this eliminates the need to heat the water. More frequent smaller water changes are best. How big is your system to do a 30g water change weekly? That doesn't sound like a "noob" system at all.

I was thinking in buying one of those ultra-precise double pumps systems to do "continuous water changing". The pump takes 50 ml / day and replace 50 ml/ at the same time (or whatever amount that fulfills your 10% weekly WC). It is a never ending process. So you have to keep always a tank full of fresh salt water, that you can replenish per week, per month, etc.

Do you think all the guys using this system have the problem you mentioned ? or they are generating to themselves another issue "How to keep clean the tank that have the new salt water".

Just a though.

 

[panayiote73]

I was thinking in buying one of those ultra-precise double pumps systems to do "continuous water changing". The pump takes 50 ml / day and replace 50 ml/ at the same time (or whatever amount that fulfills your 10% weekly WC). It is a never ending process. So you have to keep always a tank full of fresh salt water, that you can replenish per week, per month, etc.

Do you think all the guys using this system have the problem you mentioned ? or they are generating to themselves another issue "How to keep clean the tank that have the new salt water".

Just a though.

It's doable but eventually your container that's holding the saltwater will become colonized. Question is how do you deal with it. One way could be take it offline every 2 weeks for a scrub down or if you really want to get fancy install a UV. At work we have a closed system, tank is sealed and so are all the filter canisters. After the RODI is made it goes into a sealed tank, the tank water is filtered 24/7 with a 0.2 micron absolute filter and UV. Absolute filters cost many times more than regular filters because when they get dirty they stop the flow of water instead of leaking contaminants.
There's almost always a low end and high end option. Money and time are usually the 2 biggest variables.

 

[Nicole79]

I do the exact same thing... I put the salt in my 5 gallon buckets.. fill with RO and seal tightly.. a few hours before a water change I throw in the heater and a small power head.. I have never had any issues and have had mixed water in sealed buckets for well over a month before using..
I also keep the buckets in the dark, in my basement.

I ALWAYS have at least 5G of mixed saltwater in a HD bucket and never had a problem with it. I keep it there sometimes for weeks, sometimes over a month. I use it for acclimating new corals and/or when I sell a frag.

No power head, no heat, but I do keep it tightly closed. If it does go bad after its been siting for that long, I never notice or had any issues with it when I put it my tank. I might test the water next time, just cause you made me wonder now...

Not sure if that answers your question, but there you go . I would say it doesn't go bad as long as you keep it sealed and as Nick said, don't let it get contaminated .



Higor

 

[higorc]

If you keep water in a tank or bucket or barrel for 7 weeks you will start a cycle. Bacteria and Algae coat every inch of this planet. The amount of colony forming units (CFU's) in your container, water, or workspace will be your variable. In other words your unique situation will dictate the outcome but your asking for trouble.

I mix and use my water within 2-4 days. I do a weekly water change of 5g in a 120g. IMO, this eliminates the need to heat the water. More frequent smaller water changes are best. How big is your system to do a 30g water change weekly? That doesn't sound like a "noob" system at all.

I plan on testing my saltwater that I store for over a month just out of curiosity. Like I said before, I never had an issue with it.

I'm not saying u r wrong, but do u have proof of what ur staying? I would love to see some documented studies and experiments on ur thought process.

It would save me the testing :thumbup:.


Higor

Sent from my Galaxy S4

 

[panayiote73]

Working with bugs has been a big part of my life for the past 20yrs working at different levels in a clinical microbiology lab. All of my experience is on the diagnostic side but a lot of it also applies to environmental microbiology. Your welcome to stop by my work and see the RODI system we have. Just pm me.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Matt W]

I would agree about the concerns regarding bioburden overtime. Brine solution is great for growing bacteria (think about pickles). The only question is what period of time would bring the water to an alert level? Then what is that alert level? 10 CFU/mL (lol). My guess is that you would want to use water over 250 CFU/mL. Panaylote sounds like you should do a study. Maybe throw in endotoxin?

What's your water system like? I run QC for our pharma MFG site USP purified water loop. Free USP water, that I personally review the data for every week. Right now we have a tough deadleg problem and they don't want to take it out.

 

[Matt W]

I plan on testing my saltwater that I store for over a month just out of curiosity. Like I said before, I never had an issue with it.

I'm not saying u r wrong, but do u have proof of what ur staying? I would love to see some documented studies and experiments on ur thought process.

It would save me the testing :thumbup:.


Higor

Sent from my Galaxy S4

Problem is that your testing really wouldn't show any problems. You would need to test bioburden (CFU panaylote is referring to)

 

[JohnK]

I'm curious to hear more about concerns with bacterial growth in a storage barrel? I've had saltwater in the same barrel for several yrs (use some, add more water and salt, repeat) without ever sterilizing. I've never had the slightest problem, but for all I know I have plauge breeding in there ::

 

[Matt W]

Someone in the marine biology world has likely done a study on this. Sounds like a great PhD project. A quick vinegar or bleach rinse everyone once in a while in prep barrel wouldn't be a bad idea. Biofilms are more likely to grow if you keep that barrel partially filled but a quick sanitization certainly doesn't hurt.

Although, I my guess is that water would need to be 2-4 + weeks old before you would start seeing levels of bugs that "may" cause problems.

 

[higorc]

There is no question bacteria will grow pretty much anywhere (given enough time) which is not 100% sterile. Now the question becomes how much is too much? Which type is harmful?

One think I can tell from experience is that having a heater and a powerhead in a barrel of freshly mixed saltwater for a week or longer, causes some kind of "sludge" or organic build up. Every time I have done it, I get a film on the side and bottom of the barrel which does not happen when I just put a lid on the bucket with no heat or powerhead. Hence the reason I leave it with no heat and movement if I am gonna store the water for a while.

Until this day I never had any issues with freshly mixed saltwater stored for prolonged periods of time.

For that matter, what about Nutri Sea Water and Petco natural sea water? Do they expire? If so, how long are they good for? I am sure if anything they would go bad before freshly mixed saltwater since NSW has a actual live organism in it.




Higor

 

[spud]

I have a brute barrel that always has water ready to go. I do water changed every couple of days with a couple of gallons. I do not heat the water just keep it circulating. Bacteria I am not worrying about adding to my tank it's everywhere! I think heating the water could potentially cause a breeding ground for stuff, my water changes are so small I don't need to heat it.

 

[Cherokee_Dude]

Maybe related or not... I have had mixed water (Reef Crystals) prepped for a water change sit next to my tank for 2+ weeks at a time (Being Lazy).
During that time, it has had heat, circulation and light from Display tank Spillage.

I have noticed that my Brute barrel gets a 'Silt' coating of brownish film all on the interior of the barrel that can wipe down easily once the change is done. But, it is definitely bio-growth of some kind.
I have read some older threads about salt mixes leaving residue like film covering the water, and maybe this is just that. But, curiously it's coating the interior of the barrel and not sitting as a film on the water.

Moral of the story: .
I would recommend covering any mixing barrel to inhibit growth. And light is IMO a contributor (Duh, I know) to some kind of growth.

That being said, Unless contaminated with some other agent other than RO/DI and Salt mix, the water going in is still more beneficial to what I am taking out, and my skimmer "Should" be able to handle the trace 'Biological additive' I am putting in.