Parasitic Flatworms: What to Do?

[Chuck Spyropulos]

Well, even log term soaking (~72 hours) in low SG (1.021) and with a heavy dose of SeaChem did not erradicate the eggs, BUT I don't see the flatworms anymore. The problem is that this long term treatment killed my coral, which I expected. But you gotta start somewhere, right?

This coral is dead but still has the eggs on it...Does any one want it for experimental purposes? Brendon? Greg?

 

[Aquadiva]

Well, this may be a little off-topic, but none-the-less could be quite timely...

Received my issue of Coral today.....Thumbing through, the last article is entitled "Acoel Worms -- Pests in the Reef Aquarium." Now, I know these acropora eating flatworms aren't the same, but I was wondering how much of their behavioral observations carry from one species to the other.

For example, they note that the Acoel Flatworms are prolificate breeders in aquariums with high diatoms and high oxygen. Is this true of the acropora eating flatworms?

Also, they note an easy way to remove a large percentage of the offenders is to use a "light trap." Turn off the aquarium lights and shine a flashlight on a spot in the sand. They note a large portion of the worms will migrate to the spot where the light is, enabling one to siphon out most of the offenders.

It is an interesting read on the "normal" red flatworms, although I don't know how much may translate to these acropora eating ones.

Thoughts?

 

[stang8s]

well the eggs are not likely to just disapear so the question is are the eggs alive or dead. Perhaps they are dead and wont ever hatch but I guess the only way to know is to treat them and wait for hatching. I suppose you would need some untreated ones from the same batch as a control so you can know when they are supposed to be hatching.

 

[Greg Hiller]

>This coral is dead but still has the eggs on it...Does any one want it for experimental purposes? Brendon? Greg?<

I have no doubt that 70% ethanol will kill them instantly. I however would prefer not to handle them at all....

 

[Chuck Spyropulos]

I borrowed a Blue LED light with Goggles from Flighty. She says that you can see lots of critters with it. I will test it on the eggs to see if they exhibit any characteristc luminesence...before I dump the coral and the eggs. At least this might make it easier to check the rest of my system for these nasties.

 

[~Flighty~]

Too bad, the light didn't show them. It might be helpfull in determining the health of the tissue and give an earlier warning.

 

[NateHanson]

You were trying this on eggs that might be dead though, so I wouldn't give up entirely.

 

[Moe_K]

It'd suprise me if it did work.
It'd be evolutionarily advantageous to have eggs that did not flouresce. Those eggs that stay hidden have a better chance of not being eaten.

 

[clamm]

good point moe.

 

[~Flighty~]

I wouldn't nessesarilly bank on that logic. It seems that the things in the tank that are the most likely to floress are the things that are trying to stay hidden the best. The only fish that I havew found to florress are brown mottled color ones. I found some fish had brilliant colored stripes on my night dive in Aruba and when I shined a regular light on them, I couldn't see them against the rocks they were hiding on. I have a type of snail that has a small shell that only covers part of its body. They hide really well for obvious reasons but they floress really brightly.

 

[PenMan]

Dr. Mazel of NightSea has agreed to donate a light and googles to the club. We will have light available in through library. This should be available at the June meeting. Sorry to hear that it will not help us. The scope that Mike at AA had for the LFS tour would be very good for looking at the corals!

 

[NateHanson]

Can you tell me more about this scope Paul?

 

[Aquadiva]

Wow...Moe's thinking makes perfect sense, yet it doesn't always bear out (as per Cindy's observations).

Maybe those creatures that flouresce are not preyed upon by "night hunters." Hmmmmm....interesting...

Bummer the eggs didn't glow.

 

[~Flighty~]

I'm passing mine around if anyone close to me wants to try it. Definately worth it.

WWW.nightsea.com is their website.

 

[~Flighty~]

Wow...Moe's thinking makes perfect sense, yet it doesn't always bear out (as per Cindy's observations).

Maybe those creatures that flouresce are not preyed upon by "night hunters." Hmmmmm....interesting...

Bummer the eggs didn't glow.

I don't think the floressence is seen by the preditors any more than it is seen by us with the naked eye. It just gets drown out by the light that is shining on the object. you need to only shine a narow frequency of light and then filter that same frequency out to see it. I can't think of any situation in the wild where this could occour.

Also, Lots of things florress. I was amased at the things I saw

Any stain that had anything organic in it and dried floresses. Any dried drip of tank water. You don't even want to think about what a bathroom looks like with this light. I didn't sleep for a week after seeing mine.

I guess I'm saying that the florressence isn't as unusual as it sounds. Your own skin florresses anywhere you have a clogged pore as does almost anything that comes out of your body You've all seen CSI.

 

[Moe_K]

I wouldn't nessesarilly bank on that logic. It seems that the things in the tank that are the most likely to floress are the things that are trying to stay hidden the best. The only fish that I havew found to florress are brown mottled color ones. I found some fish had brilliant colored stripes on my night dive in Aruba and when I shined a regular light on them, I couldn't see them against the rocks they were hiding on. I have a type of snail that has a small shell that only covers part of its body. They hide really well for obvious reasons but they floress really brightly.

Yeah, it was just a guess.
Knowing that the camoflage fish flouresce doesn't really surprise me either. There are times when the fish would want to be detected - to the right animals. I'm thinking having some kind of flourescent pattern would be great for mating and territory defense. The object would be to remain hidden from your prey, but to be very visible to potential mates or to competitors. Flourescence can solve these demands - provided your prey can't see the flourescence.
With that in mind, I can't think of any time it'd be good to have a mass of eggs be visible in any spectrum - especially if the parents cannot or do not defend the brood.

 

[Aquadiva]

DUH!!! I am an idiot...

Yea...I forgot for a minute that those predators would need to be swimming around with yellow glasses and blue flashlights.

 

[Moe_K]

DUH!!! I am an idiot...

Yea...I forgot for a minute that those predators would need to be swimming around with yellow glasses and blue flashlights.

Not really.
Visible light drops off as we go deeper under water.
Fish and other undersea creatures have evolved ways to "see" in other spectrums. Mantis shrimp, for example, have incredibly complex eyes and I believe they can see the ultraviolet spectrum, which penetrates deeper under the water, and frequently causes flourecence.

Interestingly, most species of bees (back here on land) can see the ultraviolent spectrum. It's amazing to see that certain flowers have co-evolved to capitalize on bees seeing UV. Many flowers have pleasing colors and patterns in visible light, and still other amazing patterns that show up in the UV spectrum. Perhaps the flowers are trying to entice both the birds and the bees?

 

[Aquaman_68]

Perhaps the flowers are trying to entice both the birds and the bees?

Hey Moe this is a clean chat. None of that dirty talk!!!

 

[~Flighty~]

Not really.
Visible light drops off as we go deeper under water.
Fish and other undersea creatures have evolved ways to "see" in other spectrums. Mantis shrimp, for example, have incredibly complex eyes and I believe they can see the ultraviolet spectrum, which penetrates deeper under the water, and frequently causes flourecence.

Interestingly, most species of bees (back here on land) can see the ultraviolent spectrum. It's amazing to see that certain flowers have co-evolved to capitalize on bees seeing UV. Many flowers have pleasing colors and patterns in visible light, and still other amazing patterns that show up in the UV spectrum. Perhaps the flowers are trying to entice both the birds and the bees?

The problem, is this floressence is in the regular spectra (thats why we can see it) It only happens when a light source hits the object, the light is absorbed and is emmitted at a higher frequency. So it doesn
t happen in the dark. It is different from bioluminessence where the object makes the light. I still can't think of any way animals could see this.