YAATQ - Yet Another Auto Topoff Question

[dedfish]

I am considering 2 methods of auto topoff while I go away for a week. The system will not be completely unattended, but I want to reduce the work that my roomate will have to do.

The first method would employ a AquaLifter water pump and a 5 gallon bucket on a timer to output a set amount of topoff every nite.

The second method would employ a back pressure-rated air pump pumping air into a new 5 gallon gas can which would be air tight except for the tubing submerged in the topoff water. The air pump would also be on a timer and would discharge a set amount of water every night.

Which of these methods would you choose for a 20 gallon tank with 9 gal fuge and why?

 

[Aquadiva]

I would pick option 1 with the aqualifter...It is simple, yet effective.
However, if there is one thing I have learned in this hobby, simple is destined to cause a flood, electrocution, fire, (insert other disaster).
I am sure someone more knowledgable (and with more gadgets) will chime in shortly and tell me the folly of my ways.

Yet, I would still pick option #1.

 

[denvig]

I like method 1A Roommate. At least he can see what is happening. #2 could work as long as someone monitors it. I don't like option #3 at all, too much to go wrong.

 

[MikeG]

I just hooked up a kent float valve to a 5 gallon bucket. It is a gravity fed system, no pumps to worry about and it maintains the level in the sump. This way you don't have to worry about fluctuations in evaporation rate.

 

[Aquadiva]

I just hooked up a kent float valve to a 5 gallon bucket. It is a gravity fed system, no pumps to worry about and it maintains the level in the sump. This way you don't have to worry about fluctuations in evaporation rate.

Mike, could you please explain the "gravity fed system"? This has been mentioned numerous times on a couple of different threads, and I obviously missed something, somewhere, because I just don't have a handle on how this works?

 

[MikeG]

It is actually very simple. It works on the same principle as the float in a toilet. The water level pushes the float upward as it rises and this closes the valve where the water line comes in (It's basically a lever that when pushed up pushes a rubber seal against the opening where the water comes in). As soon as the water level begins to drop the seal is opened up and the top off water can enter. The only thing that you have to remember is that the top off resovoir has to be above the float switch. They are pretty inexpensive, around 20-30 dollars for the float valve (I have only used Kent) and you can get the fittings and polyethylene tubing at Home Depot.

 

[Reef55]

Linda, I have an extra used Kent float valve you can have for cheap. I can help you set it up too if you like. PM me

 

[wrassefan]

I've been using a digi timer and an aqualifter to top off for almost 10mo. now. I had to calculate my top off needs and based on the aqualifter supply capacity (approx 3 gal per hour). I have it come on about 5-6 times a day at various intervals and it tops off my tank with lime water. So far so good....when I went on vacation for a week, I used a 30gal rubbermaid to supply it. My brother checked on it every 3 days or so when he fed the tank. Worked great....and I'm still too lazy to hook up the float valves.

 

[dedfish]

Thanks Mike, unfortunetly I don't have the option of a gravity system.

Any other input or opinions on the 2 options I am considering?

Edit: Thanks Wrasse! You posted while I was still writing.

 

[MikeG]

What about putting an electric float valve to a pump to control top off? If you cant tell I think it is a better idea to be able to add what is needed and not a set amount. Does your evaporation rate change much from day to day depending on outside temperature?

 

[wrassefan]

dedfish
good luck..tough part is figuring out your top off needs. I watched my tank sump levels for about 2 weeks before I was comfortable. Didn't you do a floatvalve setup last yr for the office?? You can use it with the timers to prevent overflow incase it sticks.

 

[Reef55]

You can run your RO/DI line into your float valve (I do). I know I know... I run the risk of the float valve getting stuck open and flooding my house (and dropping salinity way down). However, I have an electric float valve high in my sump hooked to an electic solenoid before the kent float valve. This way if the water level gets too high in my sump (meaning too much water is going into my tank), the solenoid closes and stops additional water from being added to my tank.

Or you can do as MikeG suggested. There are a couple of ways to do this.

The easiest is just hooking an electic float swith to a small powerhead that is in the replacement water tank. Have the float so that when the water level drops, it turns on the powerhead pushing water into your sump. Problem is that it can make the powerhead turn on and off rapidly.

A better choice would be two switches with a latching relay and two electric float switches. When the level drops below the lower, it turns something on. When it the water level reaches the top electric float switch, it turns the same something off. This something could either be a pump or a solenoid. Just so happens someone is making this easy now:

http://www.autotopoff.com/products.html

I would suggest the double switch with the latching upgrade (additional $5). Then your choice either solenoid or pump.

I would go with the solenoid and a float switch on an RO/DI line. It would require both the kent float valve to stick open AND the solenoid to stick open for it to fail, and you don't have to keep filling your makeup water tank.

 

[dedfish]

I don't have a sump on this system, just what amounts to a large aquafuge like fuge that sits behind the tank. Float switches are not really an option due to several factors such as size, placement, tank real estate. My evaporation over the winter stayed pretty consistant. I initially tried to setup a float switch topoff setup for this tank, but ran into some problems...including a flood which flooded my electrical components to said system. I've been affraid to open the box and look to see how much rust and damage I caused to the relay and transformer.

Basically what I need is a quick and dirty setup to alleviate some of the topoff needs while I'm away. My roomate can watch over the tank, but I don't trust her too much to do things in a timely manner. With my luck she would wait all week and then add tap water right before I got home. I'm also trying to get my cheap webcam setup so that while I'm away I can at least monitor the tank to an extent and just call her and tell her to do things.

 

[dedfish]

Can't do anything with my RO. I live in an apartment and there is no easy way to get a RO line from my kitchen to my living room.

Thanks everyone for all the opinions and advice on using a float switch setup, I really do appreciate it, but I'd like to discuss the pros and cons to the two systems in my original post.

 

[MikeG]

I would go with the first option as well using the aqulifter pump. This system seems easier to set up and maintain, both good things when someone else is taking care of your tank

 

[dedfish]

wrassefan, how long hae you been running limwater through your AquaLifter? Have you ever attempted to clean it? Are you concerned with the limewater mucking up the pump?

I've read several opinions from people on RC saying that the pumps don't like dirty water too much and some of those that do dose limewater recommend cleaning them.

How about the rate of addition of limewater to your tank by using the AquaLifter? How long of a tubing run do you have? and how fast does it come out? From what I've read you can kinda adjust the rate by using longer tubing.

I'd love to use it for dosing limewater instead of straight RO/DI, but those are some of my concerns. I'll probably pick one up and figure all these things out for myself, they are fairly cheap.

Everyone please feel free to comment.

 

[wrassefan]

dedfish, I've been running limewater thru this aqualifter for the entire time. I've never cleaned this one but am just about to soak it in vinegar. I have one on the shelf to replace while cleaning. I use to use one on the cpr overflow with prefilter but after clogging 3, I changed to a powerhead in the sump....been great for about 5-6mo now. Tested a few times for power outage and back siphon...no issues on restart. I have the reservoir (20 gal rubbermaid) next to the tank. The clear hoses are about 3feet long. I have a piece of pvc pipe holding it down in the reservoir but not in the lime muck. This guarantees only clear limewater goes thru the aqualifter (no guarantees). I try to fill the reservoir between top off cycles so no cloudy milky limewater gets into the sump...but it happened yesterday. No ill effects but I caught it after about 3 min into topoff.