need help with ph! way high

[clamm]

Guys, this is a continuation of another post...but I still get get my ph down. Currently its at 8.8 and holding steady...even after a 35% water change, it remained at 8.8. What can I do about this? Whats causing it? What do I need to check for? Whats weird is that all the stuff in the tank seems to be doing fine...If I measure the PH of the RO/DI water I put in its up around 10...but the tds of that water is 0, so won't the fact that the tds is 0 through a pinpoint probe all out of wack? Im at a loss, I figured the water change would help but didn't at all. What can be buffering the water so well that after a 35% water change the ph is still 8.80. I want to try to figure this one out. I have had this happen before on another tank, but dont remember what fixed it...if anything...what do you guys suggest?

 

[clamm]

i have also tried adding small amounts of baking soda with top off water...it brings it down slightly for an hour or 2 and then it levels out at where it was before.

 

[wrassefan]

have you tested your water prior to mixing the salt?? wonder if your test kit is off.

Just reread the post...10 sounds way off. Maybe you could get another test kit or borrow one. Sounds way off for RO/DI water to have a ph of 10.

 

[RobboT]

When did you last calibrate your Pinpoint?

 

[Mike A]

When did you last calibrate your Pinpoint?

That would be my question as well.

Is there a reef buddy nearby that has a ph monitor that can double-check
those values ?

Also, what are you using for Ca/Alk maintenance ??

 

[Lam]

Another suggestion is bring the sample to your LFS and see if they can help measure your pH. There's a quick way to bring the pH down but I'm reluctant to give that advice. The more probable reason would be calibration error.

Double check and double check some more.

 

[Moe_K]

For the tank, I also suggest recalibrating the pH monitor.

For tap water, you can't use the monitor to measure the pH. The probe is made for saltwater. I made the same mistake, and was corrected by Randy. Use a freshwater pH reagent kit, and I bet you'll find the pH is a lot lower than 10.

After you recalibrate the monitor, it'd be interesting to see what your pH readings are. You can use a diluted white vinegar solution (dilute w/ RO/DI water) to bring the pH down, but it sounds like this might not be necessary.

 

[Lam]

You can use a diluted white vinegar solution (dilute w/ RO/DI water) to bring the pH down, but it sounds like this might not be necessary.

The advice I was avoiding especially if the pH is in actuality NOT high. You need to be absolutely sure your pH probe is accurate. I inadvertently used NON-diluted vinegar at one time and was amazed how quickly my pH shot down. I was mortified.

The vinegar is a temporary solution and IF your pH is actually high from another source, your pH will go back being high again until the culprit is found.

 

[clamm]

I have calibration solution and can try to recalibrate tonight. I also have 2 probes and the reading is the same on both....(BOTH PINPOINT)

thats the problem im having, im bringing it down and it goes right back up.

I have used kent marine buffer dKH I think its superbuffer...and turbo calcium for ca. I have stopped using both before the water change to try to determine the cause of the high PH. I can recalibrate the meter today, but I dont think it will do much good.

 

[clamm]

I can also test PH with a chemical kit as well and see what it reads...maybe there is something to learn there...comparing chemical kit to the meter.

any other suggestions
????? of stuff to look for.

 

[clamm]

ok Moe, will take your advice and recalibrate meter tonight...worth a try right?

 

[nunofs]

i have also tried adding small amounts of baking soda with top off water

Just thought I'd point out that baking soda will *raise* your pH (and alkalinity), not lower it. Also, you can't really measure the pH of your RODI water because it doesn't have any ions / dissolved solids... any number you get will be meaningless for RODI water.

Nuno

 

[clamm]

Humm...baking Soda As With Club Soda Seemed To Bring It Down For A Little While...you Sure Baking Soda Raises Ph? I Was Told Baking Soda And Or Club Soda Will Lower Ph.

 

[wrassefan]

baking soda will raise ph

 

[nunofs]

Yes, baking soda will raise the pH... that's what I use to bring the pH of RODI water up to 8.2 for freshwater dips... I also use it on my freshwater tank to bring up the pH (because the CO2 injections lowers it).

See what Anthony Calfo has to say about baking soda in this article http://www.wetwebmedia.com/alkalinity.htm :

Baking soda, sodium bicarbonate, is a significant portion of most dry mixes of sea buffer. I do not recommend using sodium bicarbonate alone for most aquarists, especially new and less experienced individuals, without the strong admonition that it can raise pH quickly and dangerously without due caution. Baking soda should only be used in small portions when water quality can be tested frequently

Nuno

 

[clamm]

Oh, ok well on the plus side adding it didnt raise the ph any...on the meter....so im betting that something else is going on...weird...any clue what adding it would cuase the ph to lower... for a few then stablilize at the level it was before I added it.

I will have to do a water change and try again...after recalibrating the probe...it just seems weird that 2 meters and 2 probes read the same and read at the level i mentioned.

 

[NateHanson]

Casey, maybe you can tell us exactly what you've been dosing in this tank, at what frequency for the month or two that it's been running. Also, can you tell us where Ca and Alk are? What sand did you use for substrate?

Basically throw out a bunch of history that may seem irrelevant to you, and something could jump out to one of the experienced people on the board.

Glad everything is still doing ok. Sometimes it's amazing how sturdy the reef environment is, when you expect it to be suffering.

Nate

 

[clamm]

Ok, the sand bed is about 3-4" of what ever ray had in his. Im not sure what it is. Im guessing southdown, but im told there is alot of established bacteria making it "live sand" Ok, as for when doing water changes, I usually add a teasoon and a 1/2 of kent marine super buffer. This is supposed to help maintain 8.3 and proper alk readings. But I only use it if I do large water changes...20gallons +. Id say that I have done 4 of them of that size. As for Ca, I dose Kent Marine turbo calcium at to maintain a ca of about 400...but have never really been over that level yet...so its a very slow drip. I also add one capfull of stroneum per week. but have only done that in the last 2 weeks...so it wasn't a factor in all this as the problems were present before that. I change at least 10G of water a week and usually more...like 20-25G. I do alot of water changes cause it is a newer tank and want to make sure the stuff like clams and a few of my fav corals live till everything is established. thats about all I can think of for now, anything I forgot???????

 

[clamm]

I will recheck CA and alk tonight and give everyone an update...also will recalbrate ph meter and compare to ph with a chemical tst kit.

 

[nunofs]

IME you shouldn't really need to add the kent buffer, it will raise your pH beyond 8.3.
When I started my first tank, I was mixing IO salt according to the directions (1/2 cup per gallon) and it resulted in a pretty low salinity, pH and alk... which I tried to correct by adding kent buffer, like you're doing. It didn't really work as I expected, so what I ended up doing was "overdosing" the salt until I got a salinity of 1.026... this alone will get you a pH of 8.2 and a 3.5 meq/l alk, which are great values to have... you will still need to dose some calcium because IO is low on calcium even at the greater than indicated doses.

Nuno