want to start putting in more coral... need input

[afboundguy]

Well I've decided to try to turn my tank into more of a reef tank if it's possible.

First thing's first. I only have a sunpaq 2 x 96 W (1 50/50 and 1 10K) for my 55 gal. I currently have a bubble tipped anenome and some green star polyp and they both seem to do fine. Is this adequate lighting to add some more corals? I realize that I will be limited in selection because I don't have a metal halide but what could I add?

I have yet to discuss this with the knowledgeable people at my local fish stores and since I won't be stopping by for a few weeks I figured I could tap into the knowledge of BRS and do some researching first. Any help would be awesome! Thanks in advance.

 

[APISTOBORELLI]

For a 55 I'd guess that the lighting might not be enough to sustain most corals. You could try some soft corals but you'd most likely need to keep them near the top.

 

[besl]

When I had a 55 gallon reef I used a Coralife Dual Aqua Linear which had 4 x 65w pc. I was able to keep various softies (trees, toadstool, etc and mushrooms) as well as some lps. You will be limited with the 200w pc, but I think you could keep shrooms and leathers (mid to high point) and maybe lps at the top).

 

[stingythingy45]

Well,I have 260 watt PC lighting over my 55 gallon.
2 -65 watt 10,000ks,2 -65 watt actinics.
I have:

Xenia
Rhodactis mushrooms
Blue,green mushrooms
Very large toadstool
Ricordeas(blue,green)
yellow polyps
green polyps
Frogspawn
Green Pipeorgan
Encrusting gorgonia
Devils Hand leather
Nepthea
Candy cane
Yellow zoas
Orange Paly
Orange monticap
Condylactis anenome

So far everything I've put in there seems to have adequate lighting.
The monticap surprised me,but it's actually thriving high in the tank.

 

[Alex]

When I first started I had 4x55w pcs on a 55. I kept some soft corals (toadstool) with no problem and even had a few of the easier to grow SPS (orange cap) up near the top. You can do it but growth is going to be extremely slow and your corals are not going to be very happy.

I eventually added VHOs, then got a 75 and added more VHO, then got halides, then got a 125 with more halides and VHO. Some people say that this hobby is addictive. I have no idea what they are talking about.

I guess the bottom line is you maybe able to keep some of the low light stuff but in the end your probably going to either add more light or go fish only. If adding more light is out of the price range you could always get a 33 long. It has the same foot print as the 55 but is much shallower.

 

[afboundguy]

I was looking at metal halide retro kits online at work and found some 150W and 175W on ebay and various other places that didn't seem too expensive. Do MH’s have to be so far away from the top of the tank (I have glass covers) in order not to heat up the H20 or even melt the glass covers? I believe my cover is about 8-10" above the glass covers.


I also contemplated getting another 96W sunpaq retro kit to bring it up to 3 96W bulbs. I think the sunqaq kit would be easier to install on my hood and a little cheaper too. Would putting another 96 W make a big difference? Keep in mind that I don't want to go crazy with the corals (that will be for my next tank when I get a house) If I do take this road what kind of bulb should I get? I would assume a daylight bulb and not another actinic. Would it be better to get a 10000K, a 6700K, or a 6700/10000K bulb? As mentioned above I believe I have a 10000K bulb. It looks like the kit I would be interested comes with a 10000°K/460 nm Actinic bulb.

One final question. Is 100W with a MH the same as a 100W with a compact fluorescent light? I'm assuming it's the same but I wanna double check. Thanks for all the help.

 

[Sean Irwin]

"One final question. Is 100W with a MH the same as a 100W with a compact fluorescent light? "
The short answer, no. Wattage does not equal actual light output (measured in lumens). Flourescents and metal halides generate light in quite different ways resulting in diffrent output in lumens. Metal halides will produce greater light (lumens) per given wattage than a flourescent. I'm kinda cranky (final exam tomorrow) so can't provide more of an explanation without sounding like a total jerk. Along with this site you might find these sites helpful:
advancedaquarist.com
wetwebmedia.com
reefkeeping.com
I think Sanjay Joshi (a helpful, lighting expert) has a lighting forum at reefcentral. Good luck!

 

[stingythingy45]

"Is this adequate lighting to add some more corals? I realize that I will be limited in selection because I don't have a metal halide but what could I add?"

"You can do it but growth is going to be extremely slow and your corals are not going to be very happy."




It really depends on what you're growing.
I would have to disagree with your statement,alex.
If a hobbiest doesn't keep water parameters right,it doesn't matter what light you have.

 

[afboundguy]

So would putting in a 70W metal halide be better than putting in a 96W compact fluorescent?

 

[stingythingy45]

I.M.E......no.
I would at least go to a 150 watt if I was going to put metal halide over my tank.And you would need 2 of them.That's one of the differences with M.H. and PC.PC doesn't have the penetrating power like M.H. to reach through a lot of water.M.H. will cover an area of 2 ft square approx.So to cover a 4 ft long 55 gallon you'll need 2 lamps.Also with metal halide you most likely will have heat issues to deal with.So buying a chiller will be the next purchase.
Trust me,I would switch to M.H. or T5s in a heartbeat if I could swing the cost right now.But you asked what you could keep under your current lamps at first.

 

[Alex]

It really depends on what you're growing.
I would have to disagree with your statement,alex.
If a hobbiest doesn't keep water parameters right,it doesn't matter what light you have.[/QUOTE]

Stingy I will agree to disagree. 192watts of PC is not very much light on a 20" deep tank. I don't like watts per gallon as it is a bad rule of thumb however in this case your looking at just under 3.5 per gallon. When you take into account the depth of the tank and the fact that PCs are not a point of source light and do not penetrate depth well I would say that light would be a limiting factor for those corals. Back in 2001 I was relatively new to the hobby and had a tank very similar to the tank that he described. It was a 55 gallon tank with 4x55 watt pcs. Back then PCs were considered a wonder bulb because of how long they lasted and the lack of heat. There were only rumors of T5s. Kind of the way people talk about LED lighting now. I kept mostly soft corals with some LPS and a couple small frags of capricornus. My water parameters were at the least decent and at the best very stable. I thought my corals were happy. Without changing anything else I added more light and it made a dramatic difference. Growth was significantly better. My soft corals weren't shedding and I had much better polyp extension from my softies.

Like I said in my earlier post you can get away with that much lighting but your corals are definitely not going to be thriving. As you stated other conditions are just as important however any one can be a limiting factor and in this case I believe 192watts over a 20" deep tank would be.


afboundguy

If your just looking to keep some softies and LPS I don't think you need to mess with the Halides. Just throw another 96 watt pc retro fit in there and call it a day. I think that would work nicely. Like I said earlier be careful before you know it you'll have a big a** tank and a big a** electric bill.

Good Luck with everything

 

[Alex]

Oh and wetwebmedia is a great site. Thats where I hung out before I was ever on reefcentral. Not sure what it's like now but back then it was a great forum with very friendly knowledgeable people.

 

[stingythingy45]

Well,then I must have an exceptional PC light over my tank.Because all my corals are happy and thriving.Perhaps it's the new bulbs or the make and model,or maybe the fact that I keep the lens clean.
Anyways..........I'm happy.

 

[Alex]

Anyways..........I'm happy.

And that's all that matters.

 

[afboundguy]

Are T5 lights better than PC? I don't really know anything about T5's, I've never done any research on them. I'll start looking right now. And what about LED's? I saw some online and I've noticed they are starting to make more of them.

The heat from MH would be a concern for me because I def couldn't afford a chiller. I am going to be making a new canopy because mine is a little old an needs replacing so I was going to build it so that if I do get MHs they could be mounted far enough away.

 

[JayM]

In general, T-5 lights are generally more highly regarded than PC lights. If you look for a t-5 fixture, look for one that has individual reflectors for each bulbs, and a cooling fan.

LED fixtures are still pretty new to the hobby, and also pretty expensive.....without much track record for longevity, etc.

 

[JohnK]

Do you have a good sense of what your goals are for keeping corals? SPS, LPS, softies, zoa's, clams..........? Usually the best approach is to plan what you want to keep, then build the system around your goals.

Couple of thoughts, couple of questions unanswered;

You probably won't be able to keep the glass covers on the tank with MH. Actually almost no one covers their tanks anymore, too much heat build up, block too much light, in the way, prevent evaporation (which cools the tank and allows you to drip kalkwater if you choose).

4x65W PC is most likely going to put quite a bit more light into a tank than 2x96W. That's 260W vs 192W, and the 260W's are spread out more which I would assume would end up being more efficient? There's also a very wide range of light intensities that different corals can be kept under. I agree with agreeing to disagree in this respect. I would say that running just 2x96W for light will be a limiting factor for livestock selection and probably growth rates.

On florescent lighting;
T-5 is clearly more popular these days. The bulbs last longer and the good T-5 set ups are very efficient. PC's are OK, but the bulbs don't last as long, and the shape of the bulbs makes them less efficient because there is no way to make a really efficient reflector for them (the bulbs get in the way of their own reflected light). VHO's are old school, but some, myself included, still prefer them because of the look/color of the actinic lights. VHO's run hot, aren't all that efficient, and they can be kind of bulky.

On MH lighting;
My favorite. Lots of heat, you will need to evaporate a good amount of water and or run a chiller. Light penetrates the water very well (deep). Many bulb options. Great lights, but you need to be prepared to deal with the heat and expense. Many/most MH users end up needing to run a lot of AC in the summer. I suggest visiting some tanks and seeing different set ups and talking to different people before making up your mind.

FWIW, if your interested I have an old 2x96W PC ballast and wires that I'd sell cheap ($20 ?). 4x96W might be a tight fit over a 55G and you'd need to find some sort of reflector, but it'd be a cheap alternative for the short term. (I personally wouldn't reccomend PC lighting to anyone, but hey, it's an alternative).

 

[afboundguy]

Jimmyj7090 where are you located? I'd be interested in taking those PC's off your hands..

I'll also look at possibly getting some 36" T5s so at 21 Ws that would put me at 255W

as for what I'd want I would probably stay away from SPS because they require the most lights. I would be interested in clams depending on their lighting requirements. I would probably stick with the LPS and softies.