Yet another ca reactor tuning thread
- Thread starter Base
- Start date
Adjusting the needle valve will be really touchy, and IME it will take a bit of time for the actual flow of Co2 to come out consistently after an adjustment. It seems pretty illogical to me, but my exp has always been that if I adjust the needle valve so the flow is just where I want it, it will then change overnight.
Best bet is to make very tiny changes and then let it run for a bit. Ie, don't adjust to acheive the bubble count you want right then, rather if you want it slower, close the valve just a hair then wait even if the bubble count doesn't seem to have changed much.
I don't get why they act like that, but that's what they seem to do
Maybe Jim T can explain it better, he knows his gases.
Best bet is to make very tiny changes and then let it run for a bit. Ie, don't adjust to acheive the bubble count you want right then, rather if you want it slower, close the valve just a hair then wait even if the bubble count doesn't seem to have changed much.
I don't get why they act like that, but that's what they seem to do
Maybe Jim T can explain it better, he knows his gases.
Jim Tansey
Well-Known Member
John what your saying is exactly what does happen, most often caused by a slight shift of the regulated output pressure due to the flow rate change. This pressure change often is very small but with such low flows we are using it can be significant, as you pointed out slow is the way to go....make a small adjustment give it a day to stabilize and check. Don't change the regulated pressure and valve settings at the same time as it will almost be impossible to control. It is difficult to give a correct output pressure to run at as it depends entirely on the characteristics of the needle valve used, most times 10-15PSI works, if the needle valve feels very sensitive use a pressure closer to the 10 PSI end.
Jim
Jim
Last edited:
OP
OP
Base
lfs employee
Thank you all very much for your help and patience.
I set it to 40 bpm. When I come back it is not bubbling in a manner that is countable. It is a stream of tiny,tiny bubbles. i have no way of knowing exactly what my adjustments are at this point. If, say I increase the co2 a tiny bit I will still have a small stream. To get it to bubble again I have to turn it way up and back down to where I want it.
While I was loosing sleep over my PH last night I descided to try to increase the ph of the effluent by dripping into a cup with an airstone. My ph instantly stopped declining! Hopefully the dramatic ph change wont cause too much precipitation.
THANKS AGAIN GUYS. Im not giving up on this thing, I dont care how long it takes. definately a humbling experience
I set it to 40 bpm. When I come back it is not bubbling in a manner that is countable. It is a stream of tiny,tiny bubbles. i have no way of knowing exactly what my adjustments are at this point. If, say I increase the co2 a tiny bit I will still have a small stream. To get it to bubble again I have to turn it way up and back down to where I want it.
While I was loosing sleep over my PH last night I descided to try to increase the ph of the effluent by dripping into a cup with an airstone. My ph instantly stopped declining! Hopefully the dramatic ph change wont cause too much precipitation.
THANKS AGAIN GUYS. Im not giving up on this thing, I dont care how long it takes. definately a humbling experience
It sounds to me like the Co2 is actually still set WAY too high. Turning it way up then back down for the temp correction doesn't work because of that effect mentioned above (vaugely by myself, and elaborated by Jim).
I'd bet that the constant stream means that the gas is going through so fast it can't form nice big seperate bubbles, it's just a stream. Think dripping faucet vs water blasting out of the faucet.
If I were you, I'd close the needle valve until the flow stops, or goes down to just a few bpm, then let it sit overnight and see where it's at.
Annoying as it would be, you can always keep the levels up with 2 part until the reactor is dialed in, but if the reactor is cranked up too high and you get a big dino problem started - well that's a lot more of a PITA to deal with.
I'd bet that the constant stream means that the gas is going through so fast it can't form nice big seperate bubbles, it's just a stream. Think dripping faucet vs water blasting out of the faucet.
If I were you, I'd close the needle valve until the flow stops, or goes down to just a few bpm, then let it sit overnight and see where it's at.
Annoying as it would be, you can always keep the levels up with 2 part until the reactor is dialed in, but if the reactor is cranked up too high and you get a big dino problem started - well that's a lot more of a PITA to deal with.
Jim Tansey
Well-Known Member
It does sound as you may have the flow rate so high it can't form individual bubbles, I would do as John suggested.
Jim
Jim
Has it settled into a steady flow rate at all? Sounds like it's never really been steady for any length of time, no? If it's been a steady 40 bpm for at least a whole day (or three days) you can start to evaluate the setting. If you got it to 40, but the next day it was an uncountable stream, you really can't make any assumptions about weather 40 bpm is in the ballpark.
Maybe the faucet analogy wasn't the best one to use. Just try to picture how the bubbles are forming, with a slow rate the bubble will swell up until it gets large enough to pop out of the tube and rise. With much more gas flowing the bubbles are getting poped out of the tube before they can gain any size so you get a stream of tiny bubbles.
Remember, it's very unlikely that the reactor will do anything consistent in terms of maintaining levels until the settings are stable and consistent for several days. It's not the kind of thing you can get right in one shot, it should take a week or two of slight tweaks to get it just right. (and any large adjustments pretty much set that time line back to day one).
Maybe the faucet analogy wasn't the best one to use. Just try to picture how the bubbles are forming, with a slow rate the bubble will swell up until it gets large enough to pop out of the tube and rise. With much more gas flowing the bubbles are getting poped out of the tube before they can gain any size so you get a stream of tiny bubbles.
Remember, it's very unlikely that the reactor will do anything consistent in terms of maintaining levels until the settings are stable and consistent for several days. It's not the kind of thing you can get right in one shot, it should take a week or two of slight tweaks to get it just right. (and any large adjustments pretty much set that time line back to day one).
Then I'd say let it run like that for a couple of days and see where it brings you.
Did I misunderstand before, were you saying you get the stream of bubbles when you turn the co2 down, and consistent bubbles when you turn it up?
Also, the airstone in the effluent cup is a good idea, some protection for the tank while you work this out.
What size tank is it again? Not to give you another headache, but you might want to go with a bit faster effluent rate and dial it in from there. Just thinking about the balance thing, now it sounds like slow flow with lots of Co2 which should be producing effluent that's maxed out in ca/alk. Possibly a faster flow but with the same co2 might actually maintain your levels better.
One other thought;
I'm not framiliar with your reactor, is it possible that excess Co2 is collecting and making it out with the effluent and not circulating/redissolving in the reactor?
Did I misunderstand before, were you saying you get the stream of bubbles when you turn the co2 down, and consistent bubbles when you turn it up?
Also, the airstone in the effluent cup is a good idea, some protection for the tank while you work this out.
What size tank is it again? Not to give you another headache, but you might want to go with a bit faster effluent rate and dial it in from there. Just thinking about the balance thing, now it sounds like slow flow with lots of Co2 which should be producing effluent that's maxed out in ca/alk. Possibly a faster flow but with the same co2 might actually maintain your levels better.
One other thought;
I'm not framiliar with your reactor, is it possible that excess Co2 is collecting and making it out with the effluent and not circulating/redissolving in the reactor?
