Dinos and Cotton Candy Algae - need a turn around

[IPWitan]

Nitrates - 0
Phosphate (hanna ul) - 0
Alk 8.5 (was about 7)
Cal 500 (bringing down)
Salt 1.025
Temp 82 (was 78)
Mag 1500

I have been frustrated with cotton candy algae as I cannot seem to control it. If Mexican turbos cannot be purchased reliably, then the tank will go nuts. I tried starving out algae so reduced feeding, raised light. it didn't go away... So tank has been neglected and dinos have set it. It probably had an infestation for 6 months. The 2 clowns, tang (noticed bumps on skin today), and clam seem happy. The zoanthids have been closed for months. The iridescent toadstools have not popped out either. I have decided to either (1) get rid of everything and nuke tank, (2) combat the dinos and cotton candy, or (3) just shut it down. I am trying option 2 right now, but may lead to option 1 based on recommendations and results of my efforts.

To combat the dinos, research suggests increasing temp to 82F. Increase alk to 8.5. Use chemiclean to make sure it isn't cyano. Removed light to refugium. The very small amount of chaeto that looked dormant, i put in display. All done. Next step is to add nitrates, increase feeding, and add a competing critter load. These steps are pending as my order should arrive on Friday.

The theory is to increase nitrates/phosphates so other thing (bugs/plants) grow to outcompete the dinos. The problem I see is that cotton candy algae will happily consume the extra phosphates and nitrates. But that stuff is annoying too. To take control of the algae, I have always used mexican turbos. But they are big - don't get small spaces - and not always available. Plus, dinos kill them. i have tried two batches and all died within 3 days - an expensive waste of money. Emerald crabs seem to trim the cotton candy (or eat it) so they seem to benefit some. I want it gone, though.

If the idea is to increase nitrates and phosphates, should I turn off my skimmer?
Should I do water changes? Changing or not changing seems to have no impact on the dinos.
Should I keep the refugium going? If so how - dinos cover the surfaces. Cotton candy grows on chaeto. Chaeto doesn't seem to outcompete dinos or cotton candy.
I was dosing 2 part, and let it run out to see if there was an impact. None that I see.
I dose kalk, but not sure how much is going in. it should be saturated kalk, but doser seems unhappy with the solution. Working on this... Clam seems fine. no coralline algae on sides. The clam is about 6 inches.

Is there a recommendation for something that eats cotton candy and also won't die to dinos? Maybe a nudibranch or even a fish? I tried a pincushion urchin that is alive after 1 month. not sure what it is eating...
Anyone have some ideas?

 

[cablez]

My freshwater mollies eat this like its candy........also have you tried reef flux, or vibrant?

 

[coralfishreef]

I’d usually say Mexican turbos, but if they’re dying then cablez suggestion might be appropriate.

Die off from the algae may cause Cyanobacteria but that’s better than dinos in my opinion.

 

[IPWitan]

I assume you are saying that Reef Flux or vibrant for the cotton candy, right? The specs say it will kill bryopsis, but is not effective against hair or other turf style algae. I will give it a little research...

 

[IPWitan]

My order of MicroBacter7 and NeoPhos and NeoNitro arrived. My goal is to increase nitrates and phosphates. Also adding MicroBacter7. The odd thing about MicroBacter7 is that it is used to reduce nitrates and phosphates. I believe the theory is that it will add organisms that will outcompete the dinos. i don't know how it will influence the cotton candy.

 

[cablez]

I used reef flux on bubble algae and it killed it. Vibrant and microbacter7 are both waste treatment bacterias.....I have heard similar to what they use in sewage systems for breaking down waste. I have both Vibrant, and MB7 on hand. Mb7 seems to be not so much for algae control, and more for general bacterial stuff...Vibrant seems to really knock the sh** out of algae. Just my experiences with this.

 

[cablez]

Basically I seeded my tank with both Vibrant, and MB7, and also Fritz turbo start, and maybe 1 other....my tank has been set up for over hal;f a year and never had ugly algae break outs, I havent had dinos, I havent even really had issues with diatoms. As I started I used these products in the past, and tested with this new set up, just right off the rip[ start dosing the bacterias....So far so good

 

[serwobow]

I think what you said about the algae being happy to consume the excess phosphates is correct. It would probably be a big mistake to start dosing nitrates and phosphates for that reason - like adding gasoline to a fire. I think you should just feed your fish a normal, healthy amount, keep the skimmer going and use one of the many methods to improve your microbial population, which seems to outcompete the microalgae for nutrients and space. One great method is vinegar dosing. Vibrant and MB7 also work for many people. Also, astrea snails are excellent and widely available - you dont need mexican turbos.

 

[IPWitan]

I think what you said about the algae being happy to consume the excess phosphates is correct. It would probably be a big mistake to start dosing nitrates and phosphates for that reason - like adding gasoline to a fire. I think you should just feed your fish a normal, healthy amount, keep the skimmer going and use one of the many methods to improve your microbial population, which seems to outcompete the microalgae for nutrients and space. One great method is vinegar dosing. Vibrant and MB7 also work for many people. Also, astrea snails are excellent and widely available - you dont need mexican turbos.

normal turbos don't seem to eat the cotton candy algae. The other problem is that feeding a frozen cube every other day isn't changing nitrate/phosphate levels. I bought some pellet food to throw in there too.

I guess I don't really understand your theory. Am I just relying on Vibrant / MB7 to kick in at some point to take out the dinos. Then, once that happens get snail to take out the cotton candy?

 

[serwobow]

Your picture looks to me like a lot of algae, maybe dinos but also a lot of other stuff (cotton candy, as you say). This algae is growing and is probably why your nutrients are at zero. So, trying to raise the nutrient level will end up just growing a lot more of that algae. I dont know what exactly what is in vibrant and MB7 (I dont think they disclose that information), but my guess is that it is a mixture of bacteria, and probably also a carbon source. Such a mixture will likely compete with algae for phosphate and nitrate, and possibly for space on the tank's surfaces. Vinegar or vodka dosing will do something similar. Many people have had luck with both approaches to get rid of algae problems.

 

[cablez]

mb7 and vibrant are waste eating bacterias. Thats why they need to be continually dosed, and not a 1 time dosing. The bacteria get in there out compete other bacterias and what not. Here is something interesting, Reef flux/fluconazole is a anti bacterial and it wipes out algaes. So this works along same lines....just need to maintain that dosing per bottle instructions. Then once you get your tank back into stability end the dosing. it's not gonna be an over night fix....ur in for a couple months. And honestly look into acclimating Mollies.....yall be sleeping on them. I personally will never buy another "reef fish" again. These things are $5 work horses..Eat the rocks clean, eat the sand bed, eat planaria, eat worms.....the most utilitarian fish I have seen, and best of all they dont know what coral is, so they dont see it as food......

 

[bonghapster]

it will take some time but it can be done. Remove the algae along the walls with razor blade, do a big water change. Take some rocks out and scrub with tooth brush and hydrogen peroxide. Let the rock sit for 5-10mins then rinse with old tank water and put back. Repeat monthly as necessary.

 

[ReeferSutherland]

When the snails die you need to take them out of the tank. They are like little nutrient batteries. They eat all the algae and thus have the nutrients tied up in their biomass, when they die those nutrients get released back into the system if you do not take them out!

 

[cablez]

Also not taking sh** here, but you should turkey baste them rocks out. seems alot of people really do not do this....blast them rocks get the detritus out, yes there is CUC, but they arent gonna eat every pore.....I turkey baste my rocks off weekly at WC time suck all the crap out of the tank that way while siphoning anyways.

 

[IPWitan]

Here is the problem - I have done most of what you have suggested for months, trying different approaches. Things I have tried
1 - 5 gallon water changes every other day. Basically, I suck 5 gallons of water siphoning out the sides, edges, rocks etc. Doesn't seem to have any effect. The tank is covered in the brown stuff the next day.
2 - I would take a power head and blast the rocks. I tried to make it so the gunk would collect in a corner or a depression in the sand, then suck it up. The tank would be clear and nice for 1 day.
3 - After cleaning sides will be clear for 24 hours. I cannot get all of it out. It doesn't disappear at night then reappear in the morning - it stays pretty much the same, just more...
4 - I cut feeding down to 1/2 a frozen cube every other day. Perhaps slowed down the brown creep to 48 hours. If I let it go 4 days it would be the same.
5 - The picture is after 1 day of cleaning out the sump and turning the light off.
6 - Increase alk to 9.0 No real different. I will try to keep it at 8.5, but for no real reason...
7 - now that temp is up to 82.5 for a week, no difference.
8 - Alk low, at around 7 or lower, no difference. I will keep it at 8.5.
9 - Day 2 of MB7 - no noticeable difference, but didn't expect one.
10 - Let salinity drop to 1.023, didn't seem to change. I generally keep it at 1.024-5.
11 - Lots of water changes, no difference the next day.
12 - CA has been really high of late, 500+. I am not sure if the salt has high CA, the dosing pump is not putting in equal amounts (I did recalibrate and the containers emptied about the same time), consumption has changed and CA not being consumed at same level as before). There are no corals, so there is the clam, snails, and coraline. No snails now as ll died, except 2 larger nassarius
13 - Just read a post from someone referencing their LFS saying cotton candy algae thrives in high CA, low nutrient tanks, which is my situation. No support thought.
14 - Another thread suggested: "I did the fluconazole for the bryopsis which I no longer have, but still have the cotton candy algae." Another thread indicated that fluconazole worked on cotton candy and bubble.
15 - Others seem to suggest Vibrant works on cotton candy.

Ideas -
1 - Vibrant may kill cotton candy. I will get rid of dinos then try on cotton candy. A bottle is almost $40 online
2 - fluconazole - some said it worked, but not sure on this one.
3 - Maybe carbon dosing. 1 shot for the tank - 1 shot for me...

 

[cablez]

I heard Vibrant working for dinos also....Dinos are a bacterial imbalance aswell....dosing the bacterias are gonna help ur tank stabilize...

 

[Mixed Reefer]

I would shut lights off. Black out. You dont have much in there. Stop water changes starve it out. You need to get out as much of the algae by hand first. Before blacking out. I use mb7 But will take at least two weeks to start to improve your tank. GFO will help phosphate reduction. There’s only a few things algae needs to thrive (carbon, light,nitrogen and phosphate) so you need to eliminate what you can. Easiest being light. Less feeding, every other day. If I was you I would shut light off and add gfo. Leave skimmer on to pick up the nitrates and phosphate that goes back into water when your algae starts to die off. Start testing weekly again it’s harder to get rid of this nuisance algae rather than doing simple maintenance. Just saying. go slow with gfo. Your tank will take some time to show improvement. Stay on it.

 

[IPWitan]

This approach says NO to adding nitrates and phosphates, correct?

I do need the wrap up the tank to remove the lighting. I forgot to add that to my list. I will stop by European Aquatics on the ride home to see if they have Vibrant. Otherwise, I will order...

 

[Mixed Reefer]

This approach says NO to adding nitrates and phosphates, correct?

I do need the wrap up the tank to remove the lighting. I forgot to add that to my list. I will stop by European Aquatics on the ride home to see if they have Vibrant. Otherwise, I will order...

No to adding. I’ve seen a lot of people say on line that after adding vibrant they got a bad case of Dino after. I wouldn’t add vibrant. I would up my maintenance slow your feeding use gfo and keep up on everything. Remove manuals also

 

[cablez]

No to adding. I’ve seen a lot of people say on line that after adding vibrant they got a bad case of Dino after. I wouldn’t add vibrant. I would up my maintenance slow your feeding use gfo and keep up on everything. Remove manuals also

The vibrant maybe caused dinos because it out competed and killed the nutrients. Usally dino is caused by lack of nutriernts. Which is why it can be stopped by adding like....stump remover acid? Nitrates to the tank. Also UV has been shown to kill some dino, depending on which he has. It's really a bacterial imbalance thats the main cause of it all....likely spurred on by a myriad of other outside situations like overfeeding, too much light ETC. Alot of people also way over dose MB7, and Vibrant......like way overdose...1ml to 1 us gallon i think.....i seen people pour it in like it was top off water lol.